Thursday, August 17, 2023

Hawaiin State Officials Refused To Release Water To Fight The Fires That Engulfed The Western Part Of Maui Until It Was Too Late

Burned stores reveal the ferocity of the Aug. 8 fire that stormed through Lahaina leaving little to nothing left at every place it touched. (David Croxford/Civil Beat/2023)  
 

How detrimental is it to allow far-left ideologues into bureaucratic public works positions? The state of Hawaii just found out this week with a blaze that engulfed the Island of Maui and killed at least 110 people. A series of management blunders are being blamed for the deadly wildfire, but one incident in particular has frightening implications. 

With wildfires ripping across West Maui on Aug. 8, a state water official delayed the release of water that landowners requested to help protect their property from damage and stop the spread. The water standoff played out over much of the day and the water didn’t come until too late. The dispute involved the Department of Land and Natural Resources’ water resource management division and West Maui Land Co., which manages agricultural and residential subdivisions in West Maui.  

Read more .... 

Update: A State Official Refused To Release Water For West Maui Fires Until It Was Too Late (Honolulu Civil Beat)  

WNU Editor: If the above reports are true, these officials should be charged for manslaughter starting with M. Kaleo Manuel, the official who refused to release water in Maui (see tweet below).

42 comments:

Water Boyz said...

the left! woke!

not that simple:
here is the history of water issues there
The fight over water is nothing new on Maui. But the impact on the county's ability to battle fires is coming clear.
A State Official Refused To Release Water For West Maui Fires Until It Was Too Late - Honolulu Civil Beat

Anonymous said...

Will the Fred persona tell WNU that he is wet behind the ears? Maybe.

The persona will start with "Sir--" write a few words and then post a link to the New York Times, Washington Post or some suitable leftwing media. Perhaps there will just be some excerpt action on bold font with out a link.

In another story a Hawaiian official told reports that it did not matter that the emergency siren was not sound it would not have made a difference. Imagine a Republican official had said that.

We know beyond a shadow of a doubt, which animals are more equal than other animals.

Anonymous said...

https://dailycaller.com/2023/08/17/maui-official-wildfires-emergency-sirens/

The excuse the Democrat is giving is that if they had sounded the alarm at night, people would have assumed (due to monthly training) that it was a tsunami and ran up the mountain.

Which begs the question. Wildfires and tsunamis are both perennial risks. Why only train for one? Wildfires happen every year in Hawaii. Tsunamis not so much. Why train for only one?

The siren went off erroneously for a nuclear train drill on the main island. So certainly the public knows that the siren is used in more than one type of disaster.

It is not like the people have eyes and would be able to see the the flames at night. Maybe King Democrat Official knows people would assume it was a tsunami warning and run up the hills and not believe their yes. We in America are told not to believe our lying eye a lot.

Anonymous said...

And Fred persona showed up with the 1st post. He used another one of his tricks with the Ha ha funny funny post name.

This time the Ha ha funny funny post name was Water Boyz said...

Anonymous said...

So Fred persona would have us believe that if there is a fire let's say in California near a town, officials will have to make the gut wrenching decision to shut off water to the firemen fighting the blaze encroaching the city, because water management.

Liberals they live. They will love you to death.

They know what is good for you from banning air conditions to banning affordable, reliable electricity and more.

DinoB said...

Lets recap:
Alarms went off for "false" Chinese attack, yet social media showed the green skies above Hawaii.
The alarms DIDN'T go off for a real event.
Seems lots of "powerful" people were/are interested in this land.
Dont release the water, let it burn and get the land discounted perhaps?

No worries....the good people of Hawaii, a state in the US of A, received 1.8 million while the Ukraine just got another 40 BILLION in addition to the 104 million they already have.

Liberals truly hate America

Anonymous said...

Defiant Maui emergency leader, who has no experience in crisis management, says activating the island's emergency sirens would have saved NO ONE - as fears grow majority of dead were children left home alone with schools closed

"'I should also note that there are no sirens mauka, or on the mountainside, where the fire was spreading down. So even if we sounded the siren, we would not have saved those people out there on the mountainside.'"

Where most of the death>? Lahaina on the coast or mountain side. If they were in the city, then the officials argument falls apart.

I bet the people on the mountainside do not worry about tsunamis, but they worry about and have plenty of experience with wild fires.

Anonymous said...

So you here sirens. You wake up. Maybe you check your phone 1st. Then you look out your window both ways. You see flames glowing on the mountainside at night. you going to run uphill?

Anonymous said...

My experience with a Hawaiian wildfire

But I was involved in a wildfire in Hawaii in 1983 that went very differently.

I was a young grunt in the 25th Infantry Division, stationed at Schofield Barracks on the island of Oahu

That is funny since no one was hurt:

"Fire! Fire! Fire!" OK. We couldn't see anything, but we started firing blank ammunition in the direction of the enemy anyway. "No, no, no, cease firing!" the same voice shouted out. "Cease fire! The jungle is on fire!" The grenade simulator had ignited the vegetation surrounding it

Good question:
"All those boots are 45 minutes away from Maui right now."

Anonymous said...

all the clamor to badmouth Fred whatshiname!
fact: the alarm did not go off when it should have
fact: the islanders were told many times in the past that when the alarm goes off get to the highest point you can for the alarm is a tsunami warning. Alas, that would have driven people to where the flames were at their worst.
fact: you simplify the entire water and hydrant issue and if you read the link above it is much closer to what took place
fact: the fires started when the electric wires fell and ignited invasive grasses and the very strong winds made the fire rage.
fact: I have been in touch with a friend who fled the fire with his wife and stayed safe in their car, returned when allowed, and found his home ok but many of the other homes not far from his were destroyed.
there are a number of contributing issues here and further investigation of course is needed. grow some balls and try to act like adults and stop your Trump-like name-calling. You see how far that is now getting him.
If you can not address an issue without using insults then you ought not comment.

Anonymous said...

fact: the alarm did not go off when it should have

That was a a considered choice by an official.

Anonymous said...

fact: the islanders were told many times in the past that when the alarm goes off get to the highest point you can for the alarm is a tsunami warning.

Fact they use the alarm system to warn of nuclear attack also.

Locally where I live the warning system is used mostly for tornadoes. I and others understand that it is also used for other disasters like nuke attack. When there is no storm in the forecast and I hear the sirens go I check of it is the 1st Monday of the month when the alarm is tested. If it is not I get worried.

Your Pal said...

A sole official in Maui is tasked with deciding when to pull warning sirens that sound out on Hawaii's second largest island during emergencies. In the case of blazing wildfires that leveled the historic town of Lahaina and left over 100 dead last week, that official chose not to sound the alarms — a decision he is now defending.

"I do not" regret not sounding the sirens, Maui Emergency Management Agency Administrator Herman Andaya told CBS News at a news conference Wednesday in his first public comments since the wildfires broke out.

"The public is trained to seek higher ground in the event that the sirens are sounded," Andaya said, adding that the sirens are primarily used to warn of tsunamis, which is why "almost all of them are found on the coast line."

"Had we sounded the sirens that night, we were afraid that people would have gone mauka (mountainside) ... and if that was the case then they would have gone into the fire," he said.

"I should also note that there are no sirens mauka, or on the mountainside, where the fire was spreading down," he said, "so even if we sounded the sirens [it] would not have saved those people on the mountainside, mauka."

Anonymous said...

Let's now have some more girly comments and wet yourselves trying to piss on someone you dislike because you hate someone who is rational, researches what he says, and makes comments that contradict the silliness of Trump's Little Legion

indictments in 4 locations? tired of winning?

Anonymous said...

After the indictment of former president Donald Trump, some have asked if Georgia law allows the governor to issue pardons. The answer is no, and Georgia’s most powerful Republican politicians are rejecting pro-Trump calls to change that.

Top Georgia Republicans dismiss pro-Trump calls to change pardon rules

Anonymous said...

Alas, that would have driven people to where the flames were at their worst.

Oh alas alas alas, so much emo for my shit emo argument.


People do not have eyes red and yellow glowing flames are the same color as the darkness of light. You are not smart by a mile.



Anonymous said...

And there the Fred persona goes.

Having carried the official party line for the Hawaiian fire unlike Winston Smith, Fred persona now transitions as always to the official party line about Trump.

It floors me that someone could be so utterly stupid. It makes you wonder, if someone is using someone else's identity as a legend.

Anonymous said...

Above
you have nothing to say. shut the fuck up. you are plain dumb and trailer trash.

Anonymous said...

Curious but when the British firebombed Hamburg at night, did civilians run to the flames or from the flames?

Could the civilians see the flames?

It is an honest question Jack. I attended public school in a blue city in a blue state.

Anonymous said...

let us now badmouth Biden, the left, and Democrats on this too:

Officials fear fire could reach Yellowknife in the Northwest Territories by the weekend.

Canada wildfire: Race to evacuate city as blaze approaches
go at it girls

Anonymous said...

Your Pal said...

Yup, more Fred persona at 12:50.

10 or 20 years ago this in your face approach by an official would not have worked. He would have resigned and maybe investigated for prosecution. As a sociologist this is interesting because it is a measurement of political power that this approach was attempted and worked.

Lot of kids died. I would not want to be this person.

Anonymous said...

"let us now badmouth Biden, the left, and Democrats on this too:"

Says the persona, who started badmouthing national level politicians first (12:56).

Anonymous said...

Canada wildfire: Race to evacuate city as blaze approaches

Wildfire out west are normal. they are not due to climate change. Unlike how some greedy, lying illiterate people will tell us.

The seeds of jack pines in fact require fire in order to grow. I know because I took an ecology/geology course at university.

"The cones on mature trees are serotinous. They open when exposed to intense heat, greater than or equal to 50 °C (122 °F).[9] The typical case is in a fire, however cones on the lower branches can open when temperatures reach 27 °C (81 °F) due to the heat being reflected off the ground"

Do I really want to comment on the fires of Yellowknife? No really. But if Democrats slavering for power blame climate change, I will.

Anonymous said...

But it's so obviously easy!

Anonymous said...

ok. read this and go at it. You took a course!

There is a clear connection between climate change and the number and severity of wildfires worldwide. Attributing a particular fire or spate of fires to climate change, however, is more difficult.
Vapour Pressure Deficit

A key figure on wildfire risk tracked by scientists is "vapour pressure deficit" (VPD), which measures how well the atmosphere can pull moisture out of plants. The higher the deficit, the more likely trees and other vegetation are to ignite.

There is evidence that this deficit has increased over the past few decades. And, in the US at least, studies have linked rising VPD levels to climate change. But it is still not clear exactly how climate change will affect this deficit in future.

The latest report from scientists at the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) in 2021 found that fire weather – dry, hot, windy conditions that make it more likely for fires to take hold – is already a growing problem in many parts of the world and will become more common in some regions if climate change gets worse.

"We know that human-induced climate change is warming Canada at about twice the global average rate," says Nathan Gillett, a research scientist at the Canadian government's environment department. A 2018 study by Canadian scientists found a significant rise in the number of large fires and area burned across Canada since 1959, with the fire season starting approximately one week earlier and ending one week later.

But can we link a specific wildfire, or spate of wildfires, with climate change directly?

Historical datasets and complex statistical models have made it possible for researchers to show the impact of rising greenhouse gas emissions on heatwaves around the world, for example, by making them more likely or severe.

Anonymous said...

"There is a clear connection between ..."

You sir are an absolute turd and I mean that in the kindest, gentlest sort of way. So someone reads something in the partisan press and the person cannot do and never has done a linear regression.

But I am to take the person's word on that it is a good article.

You are fcking, know-nothing dope that has more money than sense and it would be true, if you had but one dollar to your name.

You can argue do not take the know-nothing's word for it read the article. After so many organization have lied in the construction of so many polls. You also have so many scientist that have lied with their models. The East Anglia emails was a stink mainly because the scientist were angered that their conspiracy was uncovered.

The temperature models so far have been incorrect. the scientists have taken to adjusting temperature records for before the 1950s in order to create trend lines they want.

The 1:38 post is another Fred persona special. Copy and paste job without link so you cannot link at the underlying methods or data.

Anonymous said...

so you cannot "look" at the underlying methods or data.

Anonymous said...

The state celebrated as a tropical paradise is, in fact, one of the riskiest states in the country, according to an Associated Press analysis. Here's why.

Fires and other disasters are increasing in Hawaii, according to this AP data analysis | The Seattle Times

Anonymous said...

^^^ And Fred bulls his way forward like a train engineer blaring the horn b and paying no attention to bridge out, bulldozer on the tracks or anything else.

Anonymous said...

Robert L. Peters must go to jail.

Anonymous said...

3:12 PM
get a life retard

Anonymous said...

Retard, you keep using that word. I do not think means what you think it means.

These Are America's Most Disaster-Prone States - US News and World News

FEMA Risk index

Fires would increasing due to invasive non-native grass. Also, there are probably no controlled burns anymore. I used to live in place where it rained ash every year. They grew sugar cane in the region. So of course there were controlled burns and it was not during the rainy season.

The used to have controlled burns in Maui, but they have stopped growing sugar cane. So no more burns after 2016. So out of control fires on Maui is not surprise. A slicker would not know this.

New York Times has published the invasive grass story, so good liberals have permission to talk about it now.

How Invasive Plants Caused the Maui Fires to Rage

HC&S (Hawaiian Commercial & Sugar) was Hawaii’s last and largest sugarcane producer to end its sugar operations on Maui after 134 years. 2016 was the last harvest and the plantations 36,000 acres will be re-purposed

www.tourmaui.com/blog/maui-sugar-cane/

2016 was probably the last controlled burn on Maui. Controlled burns are the safest way to harvest sugarcane. It protects workers from snakes, spiders and ergonomic injuries. it probably makes sugarcane production more economical, so stupid Americans can get fat and slothful on sugar.

Look at the bright side. With the eradication of peons the Democrat power brokers will have a dedicated R & R island. Of course there will be a small service staff of boot lickers.

Anonymous said...

"A&B has not released specifics about the land’s use as of yet, but company officials have mentioned they plan to develop an agricultural park on 1000 to 2000 acres growing energy and food crops"

https://www.tourmaui.com/blog/maui-sugar-cane/

There we go more green energy shat!

Anonymous said...

"Maui County officials knew the fire risks, documents show" LA Times

So the ultra-liberal, far left LA Times has to admit it was more about incompetence than climate change.

Anonymous said...

Hawaiian Electric Knew of Wildfire Threat, but Waited Years to Act

Four years ago, the utility said it needed to do more to prevent its power lines from emitting sparks.

It made little progress, focusing on a shift to clean energy.



Green energy obsession kills

Anonymous said...

My take-away from these WSJ articles is that utility, county and state authorities temporized when they should have been upgrading the system and remediating the fuel load issues. Why cut the weeds and pay for the necessary fixes to the old power grid when “mandates” and shiny new technologies are coming – all paid for by somebody else? Textbook case of the unintended consequences of government overreach and false promises. My take-away from these WSJ articles is that utility, county and state authorities temporized when they should have been upgrading the system and remediating the fuel load issues. Why cut the weeds and pay for the necessary fixes to the old power grid when “mandates” and shiny new technologies are coming – all paid for by somebody else? Textbook case of the unintended consequences of government overreach and false promises.

Anonymous said...

"Maui had a firebug on the loose and a fancy warning system that didn't work: Hawaii governor blames global warming"

"So the place had a firebug running around since at least last year and there's been no news of his capture. Studies show that 80% of catastrophic wildfires -- in California, Greece and other places -- are human-caused. "

I believe that at least one of the fires was caused by powerlines. There is video of downed power lines arcing and sparking. We shall see.

Before the power lines were downed, were there any fires already extent and were fire crews working them? the Power company has deep pockets, so I believe rightly or wrongly they will shoulder the blame.

Anonymous said...

I checked information on my state's FEMA sirens, because I am utterly appalled by a blue state denizen or a lame Russian troll. For different types of emergencies, they have different signals.

Hawaii could have different signals for fire, tsunami and nuke attack. but it is a blue state, so they cannot walk and chew gum at the same time.

Anonymous said...

Siren fast facts.

Hawaiʻi has the largest single integrated Outdoor Siren Warning System for Public Safety in the world.

The all-hazard siren system can be used for a variety of both natural and human-caused events; including tsunamis, hurricanes, dam breaches, flooding, wildfires, volcanic eruptions, terrorist threats, hazardous material incidents, and more.

https://dod.hawaii.gov/hiema/all-hazard-statewide-outdoor-warning-siren-system/

Anonymous said...

A History of Tsunamis in Hawaii

https://www.civilbeat.org/2011/03/9558-a-history-of-tsunamis-in-hawaii/

"The earliest tsunami on record in Hawaii was reported in 1813 or 1814, according to the Catalogue of Tsunamis in the Hawaiian Islands by George Pararas-Carayannis. At least 85 tsunamis have hit the islands since then, including 15 that caused significant damage."

Wild fires happen every year. Tsunamis not so much. 2012 tsunami had waves 2.5 feet high.

the worst tsunami in 1945 killed 146.

I think these guys failed risk management.

Anonymous said...

FEMA manager resigned.

SAMIR SARDANA said...

WAS IT AN ACCIDENT ?

NEIN ! IT IS IN THE HEAVENS ! WHY DO FOLLOWERS OF CHRIST ALLOW A SATANIC HINDOO MASS MURDERER,LIKE NARENDRA MODI, THE PM OF INDIA, IN THEIR NATION, FETE HIM,ARM HIM AND FUND HIM TO BUTCHER MUSLIMS AND CHRISTIANS IN INDIA ?

HE IS A MASS MURDERER,OPPRESSING KASHMIRIS,MUSLIMS AND CHRISTIANS

There is a magical curse on Modi which dooms all nations that he visits and dooms all those who come to meet him !

The "Chaiwala Indian Dindoo Hindoo PM", has the "curse of satan on" him

The Satanic Effect ,has "3 layers" :

 The people "who come to meet" the Chaiwala Indian Dindoo Hindoo PM in Dindoo Hindoo Land

 The "people who invite" the Chaiwala Indian Dindoo Hindoo PM to come to their nation

 The "nation and city visited" by the Chaiwala Indian Dindoo Hindoo PM

The application of the "Theologically and Ontologically Tridented", Kant's approach, is as under:

 For White nations, who are "born of Sarah and the Isaac" - the Jews (from Isaac) and Christians (from Esau) the disaster strikes in "less than 3 months",of the visit of the Satanic Dindoo Hindoo Limpet PM of India (For example the state of Israel and the Templars of Christos and Christ - Spain, Portugal and now America)

 For White nations, who are "not born of or do not follow",the faith of Sarah and Isaac - in the "70% plus majority" (like France,UK,Russia and Germany)-the disaster strikes in less than 6 months of the visit of the Satanic Dindoo Hindoo Limpet PM of India

 For Islamic nations who are born of "Hagar or Ishmael"-the disaster strikes,in "less than 3 months" of the date of "planning the visit" of the Satanic Dindoo Hindoo Limpet PM of India

 For Boodheeest nations - there are "no proximates" - as they are doomed by "definition, history,geography and theology"

 For Atheists - there is "immunity"

The "Aristotelian Dialectic", in the above approach,for the sons of Isaac is in the Old Testament and the Babylonian Talmud

The "Ghazali Dialectic", in the above approach,for the followers of Ishmael, would be the Koran and sections of the Hadeeth

IT IS THE CURSE OF THE CHAIWALA,NARENDRA MODI ,AS I ALWAYS SAID

CHAIWALA IN SOUTH AFRICA ON 23.08.2023,NEAR JOHANNAS

https://www.narendramodi.in/prime-minister-narendra-modi-arrives-for-the-brics-summit-at-johannesburg-south-africa-573146

AND THEN A FIRE IN JOHANNAS - 77 ARE DEAD

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-africa-66667954

CHAIWALA IN GREECE ON 25.08.23

https://www.narendramodi.in/prime-minister-narendra-modi-s-meeting-with-prime-minister-of-greece-573272

ON 30.08.2023,LARGEST WIRE IN EU IN GREECE BURNING 150000
HECTARES

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/29/greece-blaze-is-largest-wildfire-ever-recorded-in-eu

MODI IN FRANCE ON 13.07.2023

https://in.ambafrance.org/Visit-to-France-of-Prime-Minister-MODI-13-and-14-July

BEFORE THAT FOR 30 DAYS FRANCE BURNS IN RIOTS

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/nearly-2000-people-convicted-over-france-riots-minister-says/

MODI IN USA ON 23.06.2023

https://mea.gov.in/bilateral-documents.htm?dtl/36711/IndiaUSA+Joint+Statement+during+the+Official+State+visit+of+Prime+Minister+Shri+Narendra+Modi+to+USA

ON 15.07,2023 MAG 7 QUAKE IN ALASKA

https://www.nationalfisherman.com/alaska/alaska-earthquake-triggered-alerts-brief-tsunami-warning

2 WEEKS AGO WORST FIRES IN MAUI IN A CENTURY IN USA - 120 KILLED AND 1000 MISSING

https://time.com/6309524/hawaii-wildfire-relief-government-shutdown/

IDALIA AND OTHER STORMS HIT USA ! WORST EVER

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-us-canada-66665397

THE LORD IS SENDING A MESSAGE ! SAMIR SARDANA

CAN THE WEST SENSE IT ?

STOP GIVING AID TO SATANISTS AND WELCOMING MAS MURDERING KILLERS LIKE NARENDRA MODI ! dindooohindoo